star wars episode i: “sometimes the only way to protect the galaxy and serve the common good is to go against direct orders”
star wars episode ii: “sometimes the only way to protect the galaxy and serve the common good is to go against direct orders”
star wars episode iii: “sometimes the only way to protect the galaxy and serve the common good is to go against direct orders; also, beware angsty white boys”
rogue one: “sometimes the only way to protect the galaxy and serve the common good is to go against direct orders”
star wars episode iv: “sometimes the only way to protect the galaxy and serve the common good is to go against direct orders”
star wars episode v: “sometimes the only way to protect the galaxy and serve the common good is to go against direct orders”
star wars episode vi: “sometimes the only way to protect the galaxy and serve the common good is to go against direct orders”
star wars episode vii: “sometimes the only way to protect the galaxy and serve the common good is to go against direct orders; also, we fucking warned you about angsty white boys”
star wars episode viii: “um, doing anything besides following direct orders is in fact the true evil? (unless those direct orders were to an angsty white boy to commit genocide in which case let’s spend two hours finding shades of gray.) but anyone else? how dare??? you not follow direct orders??? don’t you know star wars has always been about rigidly adhering to regimes???”
UPDATE
solo, a star wars story:
star wars episode vi: “sometimes the only way to protect the galaxy and serve the common good is to go against direct orders”
so we’re 9 for 10 on this, for everyone keeping score. and the only person fandom-at-large decided to court martial and send to a penal colony for ten years was NOT, as might be logical, either of the angsty white boys who committed fucking genocide. no, it was the brown guy who, by the rules of every other star wars movie, would be (aka, IS) an unquestioned valiant hero.
thank you for coming to my ted talk, we’ll reconvene with more stats after episode ix.
As someone who was actually in the military, who knew pilots irl and who identifies with Poe… Leia and Holdo were fucking idiots, sort of. It’s complicated.
The message of Episode 8 is weird and kinda obscured by the whole “follow our orders without question” subplot.
The lesson is supposed to be “people matter, individual lives matter, MORE than the mission”.
Poe violets the order to withdraw at the start of the movie because he believes taking down the Dreadnaught ship is more important than human lives. The thing is, this blow means very little to the Order. They can build more ships; you can’t resurrect a life. So the lesson Poe was meant to learn is “don’t sacrifice lives”.
However, this gets all twisted up into “don’t violate orders” when Leia and Holdo – for absolutely no reason whatsoever – decide not to tell Poe about their plans. There is no reason given for this in the movie. It COULD have been justified with “we think the Order is listening to our conversation so we can’t tell you anything”, but no reasoning is given. Leia and Holdo hold back the information purely out of pettiness, that’s the only reason I can see.
So Poe does exactly what he was raised to do, AND to uphold the lesson he’d been taught earlier: he violates orders to save lives. He thinks they’re hopelessly running away with no chance of survival, so he throws chance to the wind in an attempt to save everyone. He was taught in the first act of the movie “lives matter”, so of course he gets Finn and Rose off the ship.
In extended (but no less real) canon, he goes up against the Dreadnought as a solo suicude mission. He has no command over the bomber squadron and, anyway, thought they were across the Galaxy on another mission. The only order POE defied was his OWN return.
Tallie (the actual officer of authority over the bomber squadron) and the other bombadiers were who were unauthorized for the Dreadnought mission. We just saw Leia slap him and not Tallie Lintra bc slapping a brown guy was “funny” but slapping a white woman would have betrayed Rilo Jon’s fauxminism.
Plus, Rilo really wanted to kill a bunch of women in silent non-speaking roles and holding Poe accountable for Tallie’s actions (including Paige’s death, natch) cleared the way for his masturbatory killing-off-silent-women-in-the-name-of-equality-shut-up orgasm.
I actually really like your interpretation of the link between the Dreadnought mission (which I really wish wider fandom would acknowledge he HAD authorization for!!! Also, why didn’t Leia, the General, recall the bombadiers when she outranked both Poe and Tallie?? So many questions, so much deus ex machina to the writing…) and the later mutiny and plot with Finn and Rose! That makes so much more sense than the loosey-goosey tangent that comes across in the movie.
Depending on the count Finn had equal screen time as Rey or more in TFA, so the reduction was entirely in TLJ. And a sizeable number of TLJ stans don’t think Finn was a protagonist in the first place–I’ve heard him compared to Qui-Gon Jinn or Mace Windu–so to them that’s just the way things should be.
The mentor who died in one movie or the only black Jedi they know.
And yet Qui-Gon got his mug in the poster that’s supposed to be about the Skywalker legacy and Finn didn’t.
I seem to get an ask at least once a day from purported antis saying reylow is inevitable/canon, much like I got asks from people who profess not to like the idea of doomerey saying it’s canon. And then I have people who get legit anxiety from these asks, especially the reylow ones, to the extent I made a new tag for these folks to filter. (It’s ‘#reylo mention’ btw)
Like I said, be mad all you like. I completely sympathize. But being mad is one thing and positing completely unlikely scenarios, like an actor in an ongoing SW movie series knowing his character’s endgame in advance, is another. The latter borders on conspiracy theory, and has no effect and provides no useful information other than discouraging people and making them fearful. That leads me to believe that either this is the intended effect or you don’t understand how you come across.
Edit: Also what is it with sexualizing Rey, you misogynistic fuck.
Wow…I can’t believe such an original title. This leak had to be true…
It can’t be that fans have been just guessing this title since 2017…
It’s too early for posters to even be a twinkle in JJ’s eye. I smell bull shit
And even if it was, Order can mean anything from a new First Order to a New Jedi Order.
So Kylo is going to somehow become good in 140 minutes and create a new Jedi Order? Oh come on, can they just stop this nonsense…
If it’s a New Order it will be a New Jedi Order and guess who will start it? The bitch who had the blue lightsaber already and who has the Jedi books…
It’s pretty sexist and racist that even after 4 years people still can’t accept a black man and a white woman are the heroes of this trilogy.
Even if I hate TLJ, even that movie firmly established that Finn and Rey were the heroes and Kylo was the villain.
Love or hate Johnson, which I hate, mr. potato head went out of his way to make Kylo Ren the big bad of the sequel movies.
Seriously, just look at their screen times per imdb (both movies): Rey: 74 minutes Finn: 49 minutes Kylo: 34 minutes
Rey & Finn had more screentime in TFA than in TLJ, so with JJ back, both will likely get more screen time.
Kylo is not the main character, these are not his movies, he’s the villain. His screen time won’t change dramatically in IX, they can’t pull an convincing redemption arc in 15 minutes or make a comic relief character like Hux, with 8 minutes screen time over 2 movies, the main villain, let alone introduce a new one.
Think that I touched a nerve with my tweet. About Reylos friendzoning Finnrey and how it would be funny if Rey and Kylo turned out to be related. Now they’re jumping on my tweet bringing up to me what Daisy said about Finn and Rey being brother and sister.
All the more reason why my tweet stands. Imagine the meltdowns if Kylo and Rey were related. lmao!
Honestly, the petty side of me would love that meltdown
What is hilarious is that Daisy was talking about her and John, not about Finn and Rey, when she said that bit about brother and sister. But acknowledging that would mean they’d have to take seriously that Daisy does indeed care and care deeply about John.
Funny how they come up with (fake) reasons to say it would be an abomination for Finn and Rey to have sex 🤔
Remember this discourse about how John is a homophobe because he prefers Finnrey over Finnpoe and that OF COURSE he’s homophobic because he’s Christian and all Christians are giant homophobes? Because I just did and GOD WHAT A CRINGEFEAST THAT WAS!
Or maybe it’s just a personal preference, asshats
It’s not because he’s Christian, it’s because he’s Black. Remember when people were blaming Black voters for the California gay marriage ban passing back in 2008? Or how racists make up stories about Black Lives Matter derailing Pride, when what BLM actually did was protest Toronto Pride for 30 minutes to bring attention to issues affecting Black, indigenous, and disabled queer people? Framing Black people as homophobic is just one of the ways racists try to isolate and demonize Black people.
I’m as Finnrey as they come. No other romantic pairing for either of them will work for me. Any short search of my blog will feature love of Finnrey and hatred of reylow, doomrey, finnlow, etc.
That said, I do think it’s fair, and probably necessary, to discuss the optics of Finnrey and why so much was changed in the movies.
I wrote a post a long time back asking how Finnrey fandom could be more welcoming and supportive, particularly to black fans who at that time were getting inundated with racist messages from reylows. I received a lot of good feedback. Well that post seems to be making the rounds again because a couple of black fans reached out and we’ve been conversing. Neither of these fans likes Finnrey. Both of them feel it follows the shopworn “black man lusts after white woman because white” trope and that Rey’s feelings really aren’t comparable. I understood in part, but as I’m not black I couldn’t understand completely. To me, it seemed obvious that both of them cared deeply for one another, and I really understand what “not comparable” meant.
Then one of these fans said to me that if the Finnrey dynamic was more like in the TFA novel they might have shipped it. That confused me more, since this was a novelization of the movie they said they did not like the Finnrey dynamic in. I was told to read it and I would understand better. I borrowed it and finally got a chance to read it.
They were right. I now understand.
As Finnrey fans, I do think there is a place for debate about why the novelization made it so much more explicit that Rey found Finn attractive and was falling in love with him. I think it is fair to ask why the clunky “my friend” was added when “We’ll see each other again, I believe that, Finn” or even just “We’ll see each other again” would have sufficed. The bedside scene in the novelization was much more that of a woman leaving her love to go off on an adventure. It was a subversion of the Odysseus trope and worked well. “My friend” seemed tacked on, 19 year olds don’t talk that way, and when I first heard it I did think it odd. Having now read the novelization, I think it’s more than odd, and it seems like something JJ was told to insert.
I’m writing all this to you because one of the takeaways from my original post to the fandom was that black fans said they often felt marginalized and that their concerns are not taken seriously in the fandom, particularly about race and racism. Obviously since the person was anon, who knows who it was, but that doomrey anon you just answered? That person said almost exactly what one of the black fans I recently spoke to said, that it was possible Rey will be made to realize her feelings for Finn were not love, and that Poe makes her “tingle” in a way that Finn didn’t. That the “my friend” business was an out LF gave itself to extricate itself from having to follow through with Finnrey, they can always say Rey only felt friendship for him.
I was told that several black fans left Finnrey fandom after TLJ because of Finn’s overall treatment and because it seemed to them that the Poe and Rey meeting was meant to be significant in more ways than just, they’re meeting finally. I respectfully disagreed, feeling that 10 seconds and smiles didn’t negate all that Finn had gone through with her. The response to that was that LF had decided to make Finn a joke in TLJ so why would it be so far fetched to use him as a starter boyfriend of sorts for Rey that she could measure her feelings for in comparison to Poe and realize she liked Poe “that way” more.
You said to that anon that doomrey would be shitty storytelling. I agree 100%. I also know Daisy herself has said she does not want doomrey at all. But Finn stumbling around leaking bacta was also shitty storytelling, so was him getting tased and the suicide run that wasn’t. Yet we got all of those and much more shit in TLJ.
I think there can be reasoned debate and discussion about LF’s racism making them not care that they derail the story – and doomrey would definitely be derailing it – just so long as they appease their racist fan base who don’t want to see a black man and a white woman romantically involved, and hysterical anons declaring that the first scene of IX will be of Poe zipping up and Rey rising from off screen wiping her mouth. Several black fans feel as that anon does, that Finn might be used by LF as Rey’s romance barometer and she decided that Finn was cool but Poe really makes her knickers wet. These are not “secret doomreys” these are black fans who are angry that Finn might be discarded because of racism. So yes, while doomrey would be an awful follow to the story being told, when has that stopped LF before, is their point. It’s a good one.
It’s fine if you don’t want that discourse on your blog. But I wanted to write because I’ve been trying to be more mindful of not dismissing ideas contrary to mine, particularly on regards to racism. That doomrey anon could have, and possibly was, been written by any of the black Finnrey and former Finnrey fans who expressed the same sentiment to me privately and I think that instead of dismissing it, the fears of some black fans should be recognized, even if you don’t agree with the substance.
This was really depressing to read, but honestly you have a point. As a black fan, if you told me after TFA what would happen to Finn in TLJ, I would’ve called you a freaking idiot, but look what happened.
Honestly it sounds petty, but if Doomrey or Reylow happens, and Finn just has another TLJ situation, I’m done with Star Wars.
Ever since Finn popped his head up in the TFA trailer, people have been trying to race him and his relevance since. I can’t even comment on YouTube how I was disappointed about Finn’s treatment or him not being confirmed as Force sensitive, without getting in a Internet debate about how Finn is in a supporting character, but the co-protagonist.
I might like TFA and even defend it, but there are still things that bother me and it. Like Finn, an elite soldier, getting put into a coma, and I did hate that “my friend” line. So if IX goes south, i’m just going to give up on the fandom and never watch the sequel movies again. Star Wars can still white if that’s what they want.
that she has a friend for the first time in her entire life. It
doesn’t negate any romantic feelings or “friendzone” Finn. It definitely
seems a little clunky because the Kalonia scene was taken out but
honestly I didn’t think anything of it until I saw people online
freaking out about it. I just think the “LF made him put the line in”
stuff is too borderline conspiracy theory.
In most situations, I’d say you’re right. But the thing is–racism is ridiculous. It makes ridiculous things happen. Finn’s abrupt downgrade in importance between TFA and TLJ doesn’t make any sense precisely because it’s racist in nature, and I don’t blame Black fans one bit for being gun-shy after all that literal nonsense not only in SW but throughout the history of media. We know racism has deeply affected SW from the outset, with Han being played by Harrison Ford instead of Glynn Turman for instance.
I don’t necessarily believe that everyone’s speculations are spot-on and factual, of course. But as material for fan speculation, if not a fun kind, they have a place along with other kinds of speculation.
And I get that. I really do. But I just wish we as Finn/Rey
shippers could be more confident. We’ve got a lot of stuff going for us,
you know? I think this kind of doom and gloom makes it easier for other
shippers to put us down.
I think this was the third part of this ask, or a follow-up. I agree, Finnrey is clearly the strongest canon ship and plenty of the GA have said it’s either Finnrey or nothing. I’m all for confidence, it’s just that after all the bullshit that’s been going on some people would like caution with their confidence.
It’s also a bit unfair to say Finnrey fans are making it easier for others to put us down. Finnrey gets shat on because of a long media history of racism that makes it easy to dismiss John as a romantic lead and even laugh at the idea. There’s also the fact that many Finnrey shippers are Black women and are targeted for that reason.
The flirty Latino stereotype of Poe can die a fiery death. There’s nothing about Poe to support such a portrayal and yet it’s incredibly common.
He’s only ever flirted with Finn, but that’s not saying anything. Y’all seen Rey when she first met Finn? Her thirst got me thirsty. Rose? She couldn’t handle herself either. The idea shouldn’t be “Poe is flirty” the idea should be “Finn turns everyone into thots”
L.J.'s Obsessions 