I’m still amazed at the ability of viewers, both for and against Doomerey, to blow a literal “hi” out of all proportion. Poe and Rey saying hi is more romantic than Rey crying on Finn’s chest or her giving him a message we don’t know. Sigh.
A script with directions is not available for TLJ so far as I know, only transcripts of the dialogue.
Brace of you to assume the last dumpster fire even had a cohesive script
You know what FUCK IT.
if people can make ships out goddam nothing than so am I,
Rey and Rose *Rosey* I ship them together. *I know not ever outside the box ship name but am rolling with it*
Stormwookie! Make it happen, JJ! I saw that bridal carry! Chewie has been shipping Finnrey, just because he’s being a good mate for Rey and Finn!
I think there’s plenty of basis to headcanon him as gay, though I doubt Disney/Lucasfilm will say anything about it for another decade or so. Doomereys notwithstanding he’s never shown romantic or sexual attraction to a woman (saying “hi” doesn’t count, you demons), while he’s shown plenty to Finn in TFA before TLJ and the comic did their best to retcon it. BUT I WILL ALWAYS HAVE “KEEP IT. IT SUITS YOU” AND THE LIP BITE, OKAY.
I always saw Poe as the Star Wars version of Commander Shepard, rank puns aside, Poe always struck me as someone who never put a gender or species on love.
And that Poe and Rey saying “Hi” = them about to fall in love and have sex is horse shit.
Are Suralinda Javos and Poe Dameron in love? She even says he had a nice ass. Maybe they became lovers, or maybe they’re just friends.
Poe can have friends too. Female friends. Rey can have male friends. Shippers gotta chill.
I love Poe and Suralinda’s relationship. I personally never got a romantic vibe from them, but that could be my own bias speaking.
There probably isn’t. But if people looked at every interaction a character had with shipping googles, we’d be in a Harem anime 😂
What’s next, you’re going to tell me TFA and TLJ aren’t works of harem anime about everyone falling head over heels for Finn? Madness!
Why would I care if you’re a reylow shipper or not (my tags to this post don’t even mention them?), your op is terrible no matter what you ship or don’t ship. See? Not judging you by your preferred ships. Just by your terrible terrible use of that quote that equates shipping to race. To the extent reylows are involved at all, this is the kind of shit they pull to equate disliking their ship to racist/homophobic/ableist oppression.
with Rey deciding that her attraction to Poe oustrips her
attraction to Finn. Also I don’t get why you act as if there’s no
precedent for this in SW. Before George decided to make Luke and Leia
twins, Leia clearly was more drawn romantically to Han than to Luke. It
was suggested in the prequels and tie in material that Captain Panaka
was deeply in love with Padme and that she was attracted and receptive,
but then Anakin came along and that was that. They’re fictional, too,
fyi. (end)
You’re conflating two very different questions here. The first is whether saying “this is bad story” is the same as saying “this character had no right to make that choice.” The second, which you’ve just introduced, is about whether real-life parallels can inform the reading of a fictional story. They are two very different things and the answer to the first is “no,” while the answer to the second is “yes.”
Rey and Poe have zero romantic buildup in the first 2 movies and a rushed one-movie romantic subplot will be pretty weak compared to Finnrey. That’s judging the merits of a story involving fictional characters and has nothing to do with shaming Rey for not marrying her high school bf or whatever. Like I said in response to your previous ask, if we think of Leia like a real person she has every “right” to fall in love with Admiral Ackbar or Wedge or Mon Mothma. Does that make it a good story? No.
“Before George decided to make Luke and Leia
twins, Leia clearly was more drawn romantically to Han than to Luke.“
Pretty sure you meant “more drawn romantically to Luke than to Han,” and I’d dispute that. Luke and Leia had great rapport, yes, but even though I liked Luke/Leia better prior to the sibling reveal I still had the annoying suspicion that Han and Leia would end up together because they had the whole Slap Slap Kiss thing going on, a trope I dislike but is real nonetheless.
“It
was suggested in the prequels and tie in material that Captain Panaka
was deeply in love with Padme and that she was attracted and receptive,“
Um. Padmé and Panaka were never shown romantically on screen–idk what movies you watched–and, judging by their actors’ ages, Panaka was nearly 30 years older. I mean I really hope you’re not suggesting this supposed romance started in The Phantom Menace when Padmé was 14. Are you seriously comparing this nonexistent-on-screen and potentially horrifying “attraction” to Finn and Rey’s love built up over two movies?
@fettjango That is like SO much better. The same critiques still apply, of course–it’s pretty telling that Typho is so minor a character that anon had him confused with his uncle.
with Rey deciding that her attraction to Poe oustrips her
attraction to Finn. Also I don’t get why you act as if there’s no
precedent for this in SW. Before George decided to make Luke and Leia
twins, Leia clearly was more drawn romantically to Han than to Luke. It
was suggested in the prequels and tie in material that Captain Panaka
was deeply in love with Padme and that she was attracted and receptive,
but then Anakin came along and that was that. They’re fictional, too,
fyi. (end)
You’re conflating two very different questions here. The first is whether saying “this is bad story” is the same as saying “this character had no right to make that choice.” The second, which you’ve just introduced, is about whether real-life parallels can inform the reading of a fictional story. They are two very different things and the answer to the first is “no,” while the answer to the second is “yes.”
Rey and Poe have zero romantic buildup in the first 2 movies and a rushed one-movie romantic subplot will be pretty weak compared to Finnrey. That’s judging the merits of a story involving fictional characters and has nothing to do with shaming Rey for not marrying her high school bf or whatever. Like I said in response to your previous ask, if we think of Leia like a real person she has every “right” to fall in love with Admiral Ackbar or Wedge or Mon Mothma. Does that make it a good story? No.
“Before George decided to make Luke and Leia
twins, Leia clearly was more drawn romantically to Han than to Luke.“
Pretty sure you meant “more drawn romantically to Luke than to Han,” and I’d dispute that. Luke and Leia had great rapport, yes, but even though I liked Luke/Leia better prior to the sibling reveal I still had the annoying suspicion that Han and Leia would end up together because they had the whole Slap Slap Kiss thing going on, a trope I dislike but is real nonetheless.
“It
was suggested in the prequels and tie in material that Captain Panaka
was deeply in love with Padme and that she was attracted and receptive,“
Um. Padmé and Panaka were never shown romantically on screen–idk what movies you watched–and, judging by their actors’ ages, Panaka was nearly 30 years older. I mean I really hope you’re not suggesting this supposed romance started in The Phantom Menace when Padmé was 14. Are you seriously comparing this nonexistent-on-screen and potentially horrifying “attraction” to Finn and Rey’s love built up over two movies?
So is Finnrey unlikely because it’s too obvious or because there’s no romantic chemistry? I’ve seen anti Finnreys say both. The idea of re/lo happening, including “platonically,” as I’ve seen shippers argue at one point (by that metric Finnrey is long past canon), is not just unrealistic but disgusting to me after the events of TFA and TLJ.
Wait! What? Anakin and Padmé was unexpected by the audience? In who’s universe?
Akjadlksdjlkadjsakdasds. Sorry I can’t stop laughing.
These asshats were not around for the Prequels were they? Because I remember a huge fucking argument against Anidala being canon (and Pamdé being Luke’s and Leia’s mom) was that “it was too obvious”. And by huge I mean “you couldn’t go near any Star Wars discussion without this shit cropping up at least once” kinda big.
In its own way it was the “reylo” theory of the day. Big, annoying and its proponents enormously irritating and damaging to everyone else’s fun in fandom.
These wankers need to learn their franchise and fandom history, they’re utterly without.
Omg I had NO idea. I mean I think I was spoiled because I saw an interview by Natalie saying it was fun to play a character who is going to fall in love with a much-younger Anakin, but I just assumed from the start it was endgame. I guess that’s the viewpoint of the much-discussed GA who has 0 idea what’s going on in fandom and just looks at what’s on screen.
I wonder if all the arguments against Finnrey happening will similarly look silly in hindsight. I certainly hope so, for a number of reasons. I hope people will increasingly wonder what the big deal was.
I apologise if I’ve offended or upset you or any poc shippers first off. It really wasn’t my intention at all but if I have then I’ll take responsibility for it.
When I said that, I said it more as an exaggeration in response to ships like damerey being called racist because it’s erasing a black man. And that you could easily say that finnrey is erasing a Latino man or an Asian woman in response with the logic of that opinion.
I don’t think finnrey shippers are racist at all. I like finnrey and even though I ship them more as a platonic ship, I wouldn’t be upset if they were canon.
I was going to respond to a different reblog of yours that construed my reply to say race plays no role in shipping preferences, but I can’t seem to find it anymore. I’d like to clarify that I’m of the same opinion as the people you were deriding on this thread for saying Damerey is antiblack. There is absolutely no valid reason to dismiss Finn and Rey’s two movies of risking their lives for each other and missing each other, not to mention Rey straight up lying down to die with Finn, in favor of she and Poe literally saying hello. That’s the part that annoys me about Damerey (and one of my 374801 issues with Reylo), the dismissal and minimization of Finn and Rey’s bond.
You’re also engaging in a false equivalence here. There is nothing to “erase” between Poe and Rey, they said “hi” and bonded in the comic over being torture buddies. Rose was just plain horrible toward Finn. You can’t pretend Damerey and Finnrose had canon interactions on par with Finn and Rey and then act as though ignoring the much stronger canon bases for Finnrey is the same as pointing out the flaws in Damerey or Finnrose as canon ships.
Finally, re your tags…
You’ve been given answers. Repeatedly. You’re just choosing to ignore them. It’s fine if you don’t agree, but not engaging with the answers you’ve been given after claiming to be genuinely curious seems more than a little disingenuous.
First off I just want to say in regards to damerey and finnrose, I am genuinely confused. You’ve given answers, and I’m not ignoring them lol it’s just in most occasions that I’ve seen people who don’t like the two ships interact with shippers, it’s been very racially charged in the sense of ‘damerey is antiblack, you’re racist and hate Finn if you ship damerey’ etc etc. So with the answers you’ve provided, is that a common opinion that is shared between all anti shippers? That rose was horrible to Finn and that damerey is less than finnrey because they said hi once and had maybe one comic interaction?
Between the first two films, you’re right. Finn and Rey had more interaction and bond between them than Rey/Poe and Finn/rose. And even if you ship ships that are not finnrey, you can’t really ignore that. Do damerey shippers somehow erase Finns role in Rey’s life? Is that why the ship is considered antiblack? (I’m genuinely tryna understand because I’m not deep in the damerey ship).
I hope @lj-writes does not mind if I add my two cents.
While I will not say that all people against damerey are against it for the same reasons, most of us are against those who insist that damerey is a ***canon*** ship stretching from TFA because of a line in the TFA novelization that could be interpreted as Rey finding Poe attractive – a novelization that has now been made uncanon because of tlj.
Again, I’m only speaking for the vast majority of anti damerey folks – there are always troublemaking overdramatic outliers. People who ship damerey as a crack ship or because they find Oscar Isaac and Daisy Ridley attractive – most of us have no issue with that. It is the others, who for two years now have decided that damerey is endgame and have gone so far as to attack black and Asian finnrey shippers with racial slurs. That has, I’m sure you understand, led to bad feeling throughout the fandom, though I personally am aware that the vast majority of damerey shippers aren’t doing that or condoning that.
But to proclaim damerey canon based on two lines in a book that is no longer canon and a 10 second exchange in a movie is antiblack because it places those two relatively meaningless (in the grand scheme of things) interactions above everything that Finn and Rey went through in the first movie and partially in the second.
Also I think some of the terminology is odd. Rey and Poe didn’t have a “bond,” as you mention, as of tlj. They said hello. They were just meeting. Arguably they are bonding in the Poe Dameron comic but it is pretty clear that their two points of connection were Finn saving their lives and Kylo Ren torturing both of them. And at this point in the comic, Poe is preoccupied with what has happened to his squadron and Rey is studying the sacred Jedi texts, so they’re not even in conversation as of the latest comic I’ve seen.
Tl;Dr the majority of people who say they “don’t like/are against” damerey are not generally against the ship per se – we are against the increasing insistence that it is a canon/endgame ship and that nothing Finn and Rey did together in the past two movies meant anything because Poe and Rey smiled at each other and said hello. Since the big difference here is that Oscar Isaac is a white passing Latine and John Boyega is a dark-skinned, broad featured black man, and it almost goes without saying that if Finn were played by a white actor, the instance of “damerey” would be quite a bit less prevalent – probably on par with a ship like finnlo – then yes, it is fair and accurate to say that “canon” damerey shippers are antiblack. They are motivated by not wanting the black man to be with Rey. There can be no other reason for the insistence that damerey is the endgame ship. It would be like me insisting Finn and Kay Konnix are going to marry because they spoke once.
@atoffandhisbobby speaks truth here. (Though I’m unfamiliar with the term “broad featured?” All I get in searching for it are, like, ventilator specs, which I doubt are relevant though John certainly brings air to my lungs.) In my case, and the case of many Finnreys, it’s also been Damereys getting in our inboxes with weird asks about how Damerey is already canon or it’s racist not to ship Damerey (link, link, link, link).
To answer your first question op, while I can’t speak for all antis I’d say that’s a fairly common sentiment among us. I personally don’t interact with Damerey and Finnrose posts or shippers, I have both #damerey and #finnrose filtered and have unfollowed people who post material for these ships, especially untagged.
I also think you have a pretty flattened understanding of what it means to be critical of fandom racism. It certainly can mean self-righteous jerks going out of their way to harass shippers who are minding their own business, and I find that distasteful. (This is distinguished from pushing back against racist arguments or asking shippers who are doing something actually objectionable and harmful to stop, obviously.) The parts I find the most meaningful and worthwhile are where we point out racist patterns in fandom preferences and arguments, including for shipping. Most of the time these patterns are unconscious and implicit, and it helps me recognize my own biases and those of others so I can unlearn my own shit and formulate better arguments/understandings of stories.
In response to your second question, yes, the erasure of Finn is rampant with Damereys. See for instance this account by a Finnrey shipper who left fandom because Damereys kept cooping their Finnrey art and turning it into Damerey (link). While the described behavior took place on Instagram, Poe frequently gets inserted into Finnrey posts on Tumblr, too (link).
Similarly, the reason I filtered the #damerey tag in the first place is because I couldn’t stand how the shippers denigrate and erase Finn. Pre-TLJ I saw a Damerey shipper argue that while Finn had a “cute little crush” (ugh) on Rey, it didn’t really rise to the level of the romantic tension in the scene of Rey and Poe saying hi in the novelization. Post-TLJ there was a popular post going around saying that Poe telling Rey “I know” was in deliberate contrast to Kylo telling her she was nothing. Never mind that it was Finn she had been constantly asking about and Finn she wanted Chewie to carry a message to while she was risking her life on a foolhardy plan, and it was Finn coming back for her that was the most devastating blow against Kylo telling her she was nothing.
Well, if op actually wants to hear it from an 🐜’s mouth, Rose treated Finn terribly and dismissively, while Damerey is based on literally saying hi and its shippers frequently downplay Finn and Rey’s bond. I don’t mind people shipping whatever, I shipped Finnrose myself before TLJ came out, but I don’t have to like every ship. Yes, race isn’t all there is in a relationship and sometimes relationships between characters of color can be terrible, too! Amazing, I know.
The thing about about shippers that are obnoxious enough to consider themselves “intellectuals”, that think they’re smarter and cleverer than other fans because they can see “hidden messages” and “clues” pointing to their ship that other shippers can’t, and spew 5000 words of smart-sounding natter “proving” that their fanon ship is clearly, objectively, canon endgame…
Every single one of them, in every fandom I’ve been in so far, has sunk.
You’d think people would pick up on the patterns after a while.
Just because you can write a C-grade literary analysis doesn’t mean you can accurately predict shipping endgame. Especially if your analysis ignores actual canon.
L.J.'s Obsessions 